How do you forgive?

[Vertigo]

There is a person from my childhood who I just figured out I still hate to this day. I saw her picture on someone's myspace and it made me like physically ill to look at her.

I want to get past hating her.

I thought about contacting her to see if she'd acknowledge what she did to me, but even in the best case scenario, I really don't want to pursue a friendship with her. I just mostly want closure.

Problem is, I don't know how to go about forgiving her and myself and accepting closure. I mostly want to tell her what I think of her, but that won't do any good I don't think.

So how does one go about forgiving.

[tbhride]

Problem is, I don't know how to go about forgiving her and myself and accepting closure. I mostly want to tell her what I think of her, but that won't do any good I don't think.

Sometimes the first thing you need to do is to get things out in the open. It might be worth it to talk to her. :shrug

[Mark Carras]

I find that with situations where someone does something very clearly wrong to you and or your loved ones it is best to wait until they come to you.

A few years ago two people worked very hard to cause me and my wife a ton of problems. One of them came to me rather quickly (considering). The one who pretty much led the whole fiasco has recently said things to others that he doesn't understand why I can't just be friends again. No apology from him, no acknowledgment of what he did to me and my wife, in fact nothing to let me know he can even be trusted again.

So I say that if for nothing else then to protect yourself from more pain, wait until that person grows enough to make amends for the wrong they did. An apology with acknowledgment of wrong doing seems to be the hardest thing for people to do. So that is all I ever ask of anyone.

[Amon]

Kill her and you will be at peace! :monkey

[-deathboy-]

but before you kill her, get her address, then sign her up for a whole bunch of gay bestial porn magazines!

[MistressSpin]

In order to actually hate someone or something, that means I still feel something, be it good or bad, and that means in some aspect, I still care.

People that have truly wronged me I feel nothing for. To me, that is worse than hatred.

I'm an upfront kind of person. Sometimes it is good, sometimes it is bad. A person can sit around and wait forever waiting for someone to admit they are wrong.

Me, the first thing out of my mouth is everything I did wrong, followed by a "but", and then comes the spewing forth of everything they did that was wrong too.

And then it just kinda goes from there.

Either way, good or bad, I get closure. Either we're done for good or our relationship is better for it.

I don't spend time thinking about if only's and what ifs. That's consumption of time.....I got too many good things to consume my time....sex, music, friends, family...

Get up and do something or get over it.:thumbs

[Vertigo]

You all have some very good points. I also thought I should wait and see if she contacts me, but I highly doubt that any contact from her would involve an apology. We were very young, she was one year older than me. So from the time I was 3 to when I was 7, and my mother finally FINALLY left this girl's father, she absolutely tortured me. I wrote a blog about a couple of incidents, and this kid was so psychotic, I even have to question myself as I think or talk or write about the experiences I went through. Like sometimes I go "did this shit really happen, or am I just nuts and victimizing myself" but no, this stuff really did happen...

Anyway, I was talking to a friend of mine about it yesterday and she said that the stepfather was resentful of me, as being another man's child, and the stepsister was jealous. I found out later that he never hit his own daughters (there was a younger stepsister too, I still talk to her, and we don't have any problems). So my friend said that the girl got some kind of sick satisfaction out of riling her father up, because she knew he wouldn't hit her, but he would hit or do other things to me. And as for him, he was just a sick bastard who I would gladly shoot in the face if given the opportunity. Thankfully none of the abuse was sexual, but the emotional turmoil obviously had quite the effect on me or I wouldn't still be talking about it today.

I like to analyze things psychologically and figure out "my shit" if you know what I mean. And I find that my instant emotional reaction to certain situations stem from the abuse I suffered in that house. If I ever feel "ambushed" (which is basically what they would to do me), then I shrink into myself, I don't stand up for myself, and this EMOTIONAL reaction to things affects my work life and other situations. I have become afraid (in certain situations) to stand up for myself, which then, after the incident just makes me really angry, because I should be allowed to say to someone "You do not talk to me like that" etc... I don't think of the defense I should have used until after the fact. Then I feel anger, shame, and guilt over not standing up for myself. But that anger shame and guilt is directed toward myself, and then I feel anger, shame and guilt for feeling angry, shameful and guilty??? That's just not right.

I know not ALL things stem from these two people, because I'm sure some of you are asking "where was her mother in all this and why did she allow this man to abuse her daughter" - I have plenty of issues with my mother, and to this day we slowly work on them. I can't just cut off contact with her. Some of you HAVE cut contact with your mothers, and I just don't think I could ever do that, though in some ways she deserves it.

Anyway, I'm totally spewing now. I still haven't decided if and/or when I'm going to contact her, or what I will say if I ever do. For now I'm just trying to forgive myself, really, more than her or her father. Trying to allow myself to be angry at them without feeling guilty about it, and then find a way to get over it. Just thought I'd see if anyone here was like "Oh, you just say 'I forgive you' 5 times and then click your heels together and you feel better" lol.

[-deathboy-]

try this, just say "iforgive you" 5 times then click your heels together. it might make you feel better...
:P

[Vertigo]

try this, just say "iforgive you" 5 times then click your heels together. it might make you feel better...
:P

Nope. :hmmm

[-deathboy-]

you could try smackin her in the face with a cheesegrater!

[Vertigo]

you could try smackin her in the face with a cheesegrater!

Haha. If I ever get close enough... that might be really fun. :thumbs (her face is so ugly anyway that I don't know if it'd make much of a difference - yes I'm bitter) hehe.

[Mark Carras]

I find that with situations where someone does something very clearly wrong to you and or your loved ones it is best to wait until they come to you.

A few years ago two people worked very hard to cause me and my wife a ton of problems. One of them came to me rather quickly (considering). The one who pretty much led the whole fiasco has recently said things to others that he doesn't understand why I can't just be friends again. No apology from him, no acknowledgment of what he did to me and my wife, in fact nothing to let me know he can even be trusted again.

So I say that if for nothing else then to protect yourself from more pain, wait until that person grows enough to make amends for the wrong they did. An apology with acknowledgment of wrong doing seems to be the hardest thing for people to do. So that is all I ever ask of anyone.

In order to actually hate someone or something, that means I still feel something, be it good or bad, and that means in some aspect, I still care.

People that have truly wronged me I feel nothing for. To me, that is worse than hatred.

I'm an upfront kind of person. Sometimes it is good, sometimes it is bad. A person can sit around and wait forever waiting for someone to admit they are wrong.

Me, the first thing out of my mouth is everything I did wrong, followed by a "but", and then comes the spewing forth of everything they did that was wrong too.

And then it just kinda goes from there.

Either way, good or bad, I get closure. Either we're done for good or our relationship is better for it.

I don't spend time thinking about if only's and what ifs. That's consumption of time.....I got too many good things to consume my time....sex, music, friends, family...

Get up and do something or get over it.:thumbs

Yeah, I should have added that you should never wait for that person to come to you. You should just cut that person off from effecting you in any way. Like MistressSpin says, feel nothing. This is how I have dealt with these people that wronged me. I feel nothing. As far as cutting off contact with my mother, that is always a difficult one. Many think I am a cold bastard for doing it. Then when this time of the year comes around they think that I should call her just because "Hey, it's Christmas". Without ever thinking that the reasons for not contacting her are still going on and have not changed. I just have to accept that no one will understand it but me and my wife.

My point being that you just have to do what is best for you. That may sound selfish, but it really isn't. It's survival.

[Vertigo]

As far as cutting off contact with my mother, that is always a difficult one. Many think I am a cold bastard for doing it. Then when this time of the year comes around they think that I should call her just because "Hey, it's Christmas". Without ever thinking that the reasons for not contacting her are still going on and have not changed. I just have to accept that no one will understand it but me and my wife.
I like that you say you and your wife. My hubby has helped me so much to realize that I really needed to set some boundaries with my mother, and he gets so mad when she doesn't respect them. She did something ridiculous (I'm not going to divulge the details), and he said she could never be in our house without us or spend the night again, and she's asked me if she could sleep over(put me on the spot and not respected my boundaries) like 5 or 6 times since he banned her. If I were on my own, I definitely would have caved by now, but he is so adamant that it helps me remember that she overstepped not only MY boundaries, but HIS as well, and he is my husband and I will always take his "side"


My point being that you just have to do what is best for you. That may sound selfish, but it really isn't. It's survival.
Yes, and I think that's part of it. I worry that if I contact her and need to air some things, that it's just me being selfish and needing healing, closure, etc. and that I'd be putting her on the spot, etc. So here again, I find myself respecting her needs (whether I know them or not) over mine, which in turn makes me angry at her, and myself. Thus continues the vicious cycle. Friggin A

[CFH]

So my friend said that the girl got some kind of sick satisfaction out of riling her father up, because she knew he wouldn't hit her, but he would hit or do other things to me. And as for him, he was just a sick bastard who I would gladly shoot in the face if given the opportunity.

If there's one thing I will never understand, it's the idea of assholes like this guy thinking it's okay to hit very young children.

[Mark Carras]

If there's one thing I will never understand, it's the idea of assholes like this guy thinking it's okay to hit very young children.

I can never understand how anyone can even be capable of hurting small animals or children. If the looks in their eyes don't melt you instantly you are not human.

[SHUT UP AND DIE]

I have become afraid (in certain situations) to stand up for myself, which then, after the incident just makes me really angry, because I should be allowed to say to someone "You do not talk to me like that" etc... I don't think of the defense I should have used until after the fact. Then I feel anger, shame, and guilt over not standing up for myself. But that anger shame and guilt is directed toward myself, and then I feel anger, shame and guilt for feeling angry, shameful and guilty??? That's just not right.

You should let your ANGER take control of your fear. Most people won't agree with me on this, but when it comes to shit like situations where you need to stand up for yourself: GET PISSED. Fuck fear.....it's only a hinderance, and I understand, because I lived with sheer terror for four years of my life.

I have plenty of issues with my mother, and to this day we slowly work on them. I can't just cut off contact with her. Some of you HAVE cut contact with your mothers, and I just don't think I could ever do that, though in some ways she deserves it.

Hmmmm....mothers......they're supposed to be supportive and nurturing. Mine first kicked me out at age 6 in the east coast winter of '84. Then she dated a man for 4 years that beat both of us up. She neglected me for this guy, leaving me at home for 3 days in a row with no food. Later she kicked me out again in '92 in February in Virginia. FF a few more years and she told me that she wished I was never born...I FEEL YA ON SHITTY MOMS!!!!! WORD! Your mom may or may not have been worse than mine, ut whatever the case, I feel for you....mother is someone that should always be there....and sometimes all you get is a failure for a mother. Hopefully, you can still renew ties with your mom!

[SHUT UP AND DIE]

oh goddamn, this board is gay with quotes......sorry I fucked them up......

[Mark Carras]

oh goddamn, this board is gay with quotes......sorry I fucked them up......

Is it the board or the user? :P On the serious side, you just gave too much info. I find in almost every case when someone messes up BB code, it is because they type too much info. An end quote just needs the word quote in square brackets with the slash before it.

I'm going to fix the post now. :cheers

[SHUT UP AND DIE]

yeah, sorry......it was a case of stupid user.... :( Thanks for fixing that.....

[Vertigo]

Well I think I'm getting over this thing, luckily. I don't think I'll ever truly forgive them, but I'm not ill when I see her picture anymore. I spent a lot of time talking things out with a couple of empathetic people, and I feel pretty good about my life. My life in general is really great, and I found a quote that fits this perfectly: "Live well, it is the best revenge"... For me, I know that I am better than these people, and I refuse to give them the satisfaction of even bothering with them either way. I don't want to pursue a friendship, and I don't want to have any more conflict with them and feed their evil tendencies.

So, I'm just going to be me, and know that I chose, before I ever came to this realm, certain people to play certain villain roles in my life, and that in spite of their abuse (and maybe a little because of it) I became a stronger person.

[tbhride]

My favorite words to live by are "I'm just looking for some tush" -- ZZ Top :D

Seriously though, its good to hear you are getting through this.

[slamtv]

I hafta agree with SUAD on this one.
Your hatred is a natural part of you, so embrace it. If forgiveness was was in your nature, why are you having such a hard time with it?

[Vertigo]

I don't think being unforgiving is the same as being hateful. I say "hate" in my first post as just a word. I don't truly hate these people. I just think they're pathetic. I think what I would have needed to do was to either forgive them OR get some kind of revenge on them IF I actually reached out and contacted them. But now I've decided that I don't want to forgive OR be vengeful, I'd just rather forget (and I don't mean "block out", but just forget)...

What I DO embrace is my strength, and the lessons learned from them (Like what type of psychos to avoid) - things like that. I don't embrace hatred. I'm not a hateful person.

[Mark Carras]

The hate is swelling in you now. Take your Jedi weapon. Use it. I am unarmed. Strike me down with it. Give in to your anger.

Come to the darkside Linda! We have cookies!

http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts/generic/939f/

[Vertigo]

NO!

I have my own cookies.

lol

[Amon]

I can never understand how anyone can even be capable of hurting small animals .

I think you forgot about my hedgehog "Pissy".
That thing needed to be hurt!! :p
We should have cooked it, or skinned it and fed it to my lizard!;)

[SHUT UP AND DIE]

I can never understand how anyone can even be capable of hurting small animals or children. If the looks in their eyes don't melt you instantly you are not human.

Holy shit I just now saw this.....


As far as animals go.....it depends on the animal and it also depends on the purpose of hurting it.

As for children, nothing will make my blood boil faster than a child that has been hurt for no good reason or neglected. I treasure my son like a gift from heaven, and I don't even believe in heaven. . Call it personal if you will, but I will personally make it my own mission to hurt those who hurt the innocent if I am in the know of the situation. NO CHILD DESERVES TO BE HURT when it comes to discipline. Now, a smack, pop, or slap on the rear or cheek is going to happen when you rear offspring, but things that go too far.........well...go too far. Never should your child have to go to the emergency room because of your "discipline".

[Vertigo]

Holy shit I just now saw this.....


As far as animals go.....it depends on the animal and it also depends on the purpose of hurting it.

As for children, nothing will make my blood boil faster than a child that has been hurt for no good reason or neglected. I treasure my son like a gift from heaven, and I don't even believe in heaven. . Call it personal if you will, but I will personally make it my own mission to hurt those who hurt the innocent if I am in the know of the situation. NO CHILD DESERVES TO BE HURT when it comes to discipline. Now, a smack, pop, or slap on the rear or cheek is going to happen when you rear offspring, but things that go too far.........well...go too far. Never should your child have to go to the emergency room because of your "discipline".

yep, I'm with you, I don't see anything wrong with a "smack, pop, or slap on the rear or cheek" either. Those are those kind of things that sometimes you will just have to do to stop the action and get the attention of the kid so that you can THEN discuss what they are doing wrong and correct them. There's a huge difference between a smack/pop/slap and a sheer beating for no reason, or for a "perceived" reason (I think some parents' brains turn off as soon as the child is born and they go a bit nutty).

The kid is going to remember the abuse and be afraid of getting severely beaten - not WHY they were/are beaten. You have to "use your words" just as you tell your children to use their words. They need to know what's expected of them, know the punishment(s) for not meeting the expectations, and then those punishments need to be followed up on, not just threatened. Punishments are way more effective if they "fit the crime" so to speak - severe beatings will only make the kid resent you.

I bet your kid is awesome SUAD - I bet you are a pretty awesome parent.

I keep arguing with my mom currently because she is dating a man who is getting a divorce and fighting for custody of his 7 year old. I think back on how she was when I was 6 and 7, and how I see her talk to this kid, and I keep telling her what he's likely feeling, thinking, etc, and that she's being unfair, or overstepping her bounds, and instead of hearing my inner child that's speaking to her, she just gets defensive and says shit like "well at least here he has rules and structure" - yeah the only thing she's structuring at this time, and if she keeps up the direction she's going, is his sheer resentment of her as he grows older - and I was a quiet, shy, reserved girl, only because I HAD to be (or else). He's a boy - and he's not "hers" - and once he's a teenager, I really fear for their household.